Power Steering

[Ck530]

Hello there, I was wondering if any can help me with a problem I am having with my Case 530 Tractor. For a long time I have been trying to make the power steering work reliably. I have bought used pumps and had them rebuilt. They work not very well for a little while and then fail (loose what little pressure they had and leak PS fluid into engine. I have had the PS cylinder apart and see no leaks and all the O-rings are not cut and seem to seal well in the bore.

I kind of have soured on the replacement pump idea as they are scarce, expensive, and not worked to date. The tractor has a factory front end loader on it and I was wondering if it would be possible to splice the PS lines into it. Has anyone done this or think it will work? Thanks

 

[Bob]

"tractor has a factory front end loader on it and I was wondering if it would be possible to splice the PS lines into it"

You've sure had a bad time with the P.S. pumps, dunno if that is typical or if something is "killing" them?

To power the power steering from the loader pump flow you will need a "priority valve" to split the flow from the pump into a "priority" flow of 2-3 GPM, or so for the steering with the remainder going to the loader, and a small "leak off" line back to the tank.

Also, you need a relief valve, some priority valves have them built-in, otherwise you need one ahead of the priority valve.


If you search the archives on this site and GOOGLE you sill find lots of info, part numbers, etc. to accomplish what you are trying to do.

 

[Ck530]

Thanks I was thinking of taking the pressure off of a unused 1/8 hole in the loader control (hooked to supply from pump) and returning it to a nearby fill point for the loader supply tank. Do you think this would limit the flow enough?

Is the relief valve to lower the pressure to the steering cylinder? If so, what pressure should do you think would be best?

Thank you for your information.

 

[Bob]

(quoted from post at 12:37:55 03/27/20) Thanks I was thinking of taking the pressure off of a unused 1/8 hole in the loader control (hooked to supply from pump) and returning it to a nearby fill point for the loader supply tank. Do you think this would limit the flow enough?

Is the relief valve to lower the pressure to the steering cylinder? If so, what pressure should do you think would be best?

Thank you for your information.

Since your loader hydraulics are almost certainly "open center" you NEED a priority valve ahead of the loader valve to make this work.

Tapping into what's there won't work because there is NO pressure in the system, just FLOW unless a loader function is being used.

A relief valve, either internal to the priority valve or external is needed to relieve pressure when the wheels are turned one way or the other to their "stop". Something will BREAK unless there's a relief valve in the circuit.

The relief valve is now in the power steering pump itself, which you want to eliminate.

Looking at this another way, I don't know your skills or what tools you have at your disposal or if keeping somewhat of an original look matters, but power steering pumps from HD pickup trucks or MD trucks have been swapped onto tractors in place of the $$$$ or impossible to find OEM pump.

That might be something to consider, as well.

 

[Janicholson]

The idea of a hole to control flow is, unfortunately, not going to work. A priority valve blocks the (in this case) loader
pump output until a pressure is regulated to a output port to the PS control valve. this loads the pump at all times to that
pressure. The remaining flow is directed to the loader control valves, where it is either used to move a cylinder on the
loader up, down, tilt or dump. If the loader is not being put in motion, the oil is returned to the system reservoir at zero
pressure. This is a purchased fixed, or adjustable device, not home made. I hope this helps. Jim

 

[Ck530]

The valve set may have a priority valve built into it as it is large and there large line (as well as lines to the loader cylinders) which appears to return to the tank. If there is a way to post a picture, I could do so.

You know, I was thinking about an add on power steering pump as well. Just not sure how to add it on the motor. I have noticed the pto shaft off of the front of the motor to the loader pump and was wondering....

I have a parts motor (car) laying around and it does have a PS pump on it. As for the tractor it's time it works somewhat reliably or its time to get something that does. Original looks not a must

Again thanks to the both of you for your thoughts and knowledge.

 

[Bob]

(quoted from post at 13:14:49 03/27/20) The valve set may have a priority valve built into it as it is large and there large line (as well as lines to the loader cylinders) which appears to return to the tank. If there is a way to post a picture, I could do so.

You know, I was thinking about an add on power steering pump as well. Just not sure how to add it on the motor. I have noticed the pto shaft off of the front of the motor to the loader pump and was wondering....

I have a parts motor (car) laying around and it does have a PS pump on it. As for the tractor it's time it works somewhat reliably or its time to get something that does. Original looks not a must

Again thanks to the both of you for your thoughts and knowledge.

"The loader valve set may have a priority valve built into"

That is EXTREMELY unlikely.

 

[Ck530]

Ok, you both have given me some things to think about, I will explore the site as suggested. If you think of anything else, please let me know. I appreciate all the information.

 

[caterpillar guy]

Didn't those tractors have a separate pump and tank for the power steering from the rest of the hydraulics?

 

[D Slater]

Think some had the charr lynn type pump. Is that what you have?

 

[Adirondack case guy]

Go down to the CASE DB forum and ask there.
As usual there is a lot of misinformation being posted here by people not familiar
with CASE tractors. There were 4 different power steering systems offered on 530
tractors over the years. All were engine mounted pumps with self contained systems.
You failed to say which one you have, and pump failure were very rare.
The hydraulic pump that supplies your loader is barely sufficient to supply the
loader, to say nothing of siffening off gallonage to operate your power steering.
Fix the pump issue!!!! not create more problem.
Loren

 

[Bob]

(quoted from post at 17:58:42 03/27/20) Go down to the CASE DB forum and ask there.
As usual there is a lot of misinformation being posted here by people not familiar
with CASE tractors. There were 4 different power steering systems offered on 530
tractors over the years. All were engine mounted pumps with self contained systems.
You failed to say which one you have, and pump failure were very rare.
The hydraulic pump that supplies your loader is barely sufficient to supply the
loader, to say nothing of siffening off gallonage to operate your power steering.
Fix the pump issue!!!! not create more problem.
Loren

"As usual there is a lot of misinformation being posted here"

WHAT misinformation was posted here, he said he had a "dedicated" PS pump, we "ran with that info", WHAT info do you have that contradicts the responses???

I understand you like CASEs, (as do I) but there's nothing magical or special about the power steering system (AFAIK) on the O.P.s tractor, heck, I don't think CASE even made most of it, just generic hydraulic parts from outside vendors.

NO reason it can't be changed/modified/reworked if originality is not an issue.

 

[Ck530]

I did some looking around about an mounting an additional pump and repairing the original pump is not out of the question. However, so far I have had no luck in doing so Here is the story (briefly) so far.

I bought the tractor just before it went to the scrapper. It had some problems including the power steering. The original pump was fried, gears galled end plate grooved. Bought replacement pump, missing one mounting point. It work somewhat but eventually failed. Local Case Dealer recommended guy who did their antique tractor hydraulic work. He went through it machined end plate (now three mounting points). Put it on did not work as well as when it was part from tractor bone yard and leaked PS fluid into engine. Tried another shop that my brother recommended, (he lives out of town) with pretty much same results.

I am not adverse to trying to fix it, but no luck so far. Any ideas? The loader (I think it says Case W31) on the thing seems not to want for any fluid. There is a large pump bolted to the frame of the tractor and it will pick up about 1,000 or more pounds. That is what put the thought of tapping into it's supply for the power steering.

 

[Ck530]

Yes your right. There is a separate reservoir that mounts above the distributor

 

[jon f mn]

Sounds to me like the folks doing the work messed up
somehow. I would take it back to one and explain the issue,
they may have a solution. Other wise go down to the case
forum and ask there. Ask for Don Livingston, he has a lot of
used case parts, great person to deal with too. There is also
Gotvald imp in Pierz Mn that may be able to help you out.
(320) 355-2500 There are also several case pages on fb
that are excellent sources for parts. Ask on any one of them
and I'm sure you will get a response.

 

[Adirondack case guy]

Bob; No one isolated the failing pump problem, (quite rare) and poster was very
vague on what he had. He never mentioned at first that he had machine work done on the
PS pump. Lots of red flags there, as you know.-----------Loren

 

[Ck530]

I have read that name before, but not sure what that referrers to.

 

[Ck530]

(quoted from post at 05:46:30 03/28/20) Sounds to me like the folks doing the work messed up
somehow. I would take it back to one and explain the issue,
they may have a solution. Other wise go down to the case
forum and ask there. Ask for Don Livingston, he has a lot of
used case parts, great person to deal with too. There is also
Gotvald imp in Pierz Mn that may be able to help you out.
(320) 355-2500 There are also several case pages on fb
that are excellent sources for parts. Ask on any one of them
and I'm sure you will get a response.

I did take the pump in to have someone look at it, figured might as well start with something that was something of a know quantity. The information tag was not on the pump, is there a certain model/style/manufacturer they put on these tractors? Not sure of the age of the tractor because the data plate was not on it when I got it. Somewhere I read that the fact that it has an Eagle 3 point hitch and all the instruments in one display may make it a certain year range. Is this something I can ask here or in some other post? Thanks again to everyone for the help.

 

[Ck530]

OK, got the pump back from the hydraulic pump shop. He said that it is warn but should produce some pressure. Been to more than one shop that says they can not bench test this type of pump.

Put it on the tractor and started it up. I put the bucket down and raised the front wheel off of the ground. I turned them side to side to bleed the system. I noticed that it is easier to turn the wheel to the left than right. If the motor is not running the effort is the same either direction.

With weight on the front wheels, even with the motor running at a pretty good speed, no assist. The control sleeve on the cylinder appears to move the same distance when turned left or right.

I found a exploded view of the steering system and all the hoses appear to be correctly installed. Any ideas? Thanks for any help.

(quoted from post at 10:05:48 04/07/20)

(quoted from post at 05:46:30 03/28/20) Sounds to me like the folks doing the work messed up
somehow. I would take it back to one and explain the issue,
they may have a solution. Other wise go down to the case
forum and ask there. Ask for Don Livingston, he has a lot of
used case parts, great person to deal with too. There is also
Gotvald imp in Pierz Mn that may be able to help you out.
(320) 355-2500 There are also several case pages on fb
that are excellent sources for parts. Ask on any one of them
and I'm sure you will get a response.

I did take the pump in to have someone look at it, figured might as well start with something that was something of a know quantity. The information tag was not on the pump, is there a certain model/style/manufacturer they put on these tractors? Not sure of the age of the tractor because the data plate was not on it when I got it. Somewhere I read that the fact that it has an Eagle 3 point hitch and all the instruments in one display may make it a certain year range. Is this something I can ask here or in some other post? Thanks again to everyone for the help.