Shop Time (parasitic battery drain)

[Hobo,NC]

Not much interesting has went on lately I have had two gm's with a
parasitic battery drain. Not long after the china flue I had a run with this issue most of the time their was not much I could do about it. If you completely drain a battery a few times it does take its toll on the battery. I guess I got it across you have to drive it a bit every now and again. On one I did not find a thing wrong with it other than letting it go dead so many times it hurt the battery.

They have lost the remotes are thought the one they had was defective. Their complaint sometimes the alarm goes off if you use the key to unlock the door. I tried to defeat the alarm I think I missed are did not see the wires in the door latch I needed to jump till after I had ordered and programed 4 new key fobs. It got a new AC delco 140RC battery.

On the second one a 2002 Cadillac Escalade (A real P.O.S) it did have a battery drain of 175ma. It takes a good 2 hour for those to power down this one took 4 hours to power down to 175ma. Its hard to do these old school when you pull a fuse and put it back in it can and will wake it back up and then you have to wait hours for it to power down. My scan took has a function to power it down I am missing something its not working like I think it should.

OK I am stuck on 175Ma before I call it a day I pull out my flir thermal imaging camera I see a circuit breaker in the dash fuse center that's hot.

I pull it my drain is gone : ) I put it back in I go though the interior looking for something that sticks out the cassette player sticks out.

I remove it from the dash

I disconnect it the drain is gone : ) I can live with 30ma

My honda has a leak I thought it was the sunroof to make a long story short it ended up the pinch weld where the roof is connected to the A pillar was where it was at. I had already started digging all the factory sealer out when I took the pix. No pay in working on your on vehicle its hammer down not much time for pix. Lower left is the top left corner of the windshield NO WAY i would buy a new car with a hole in the roof. Back to the Cadillac I fixed the sun roof from leak sometime back he told me the sunroof leaked on the cassette player and it stopped working.

This post was edited by Hobo,NC on 03/25/2022 at 07:09 pm.

 

[Patsdeere]

Genius on the flir camera.

 

[Mark-Mi]

X 2. Never would have thought of using a thermal camera for a parasitic draw.

 

[Hoenes]

I had a parasitic drain on the wife's Impala. 2 bad alternators in a
row. (Rebuilt, never again!) Kept throwing security shutdown. I was
determined it was the BCM. Changed that, no avail. Still had
security shut downs. Put a new Delphi alternator on, no drain, no
battery parasitic draw down. Counting the original OEM alt., that went bad, that made 3 in a row. Who would have ever thought.

 

[M-MAN]

Son in laws Honda Pilot was leaking in
the same area. Did you have to pull the
windshield ?

 

[MarkB_MI]

Thanks for a really interesting post!

 

[Sprint 6]

FLIR cameras are awesome for battery
drains. The one in the pic I would never
have found without mine. 2012 Silverado,
underhood fuse block corroded internally,
VERY intermittent dead battery. It would
be fine for months, then be dead overnight,
then another month.

Watch out for OnStar module drains on old
gm products. I have run into several that
for some reason have reactivated and
intermittently kill the battery.

 

[Liquid_wrench]

Our 2014 Impala was leaking at the A pillar and running down to the drivers side floor. I pulled the
headliner down and trim, then sealed it with Permatex Silicone 81158 Adhesive, It's been good 2 years now.
My 2005 Silverado used to drain the battery, I think mine was the door latches were stuck where I used
woolwax undercoating, I cleaned all 4 and so far so good.

 

[UncleTom]

Awesome info. I never would have thought a flir could be used either. Keep it coming.

 

[Bill(Wis)]

 

[Geo-TH,In]

HoBo
I had a 2 door Cadillac, 1960's,. It took 4 days to drain the
battery. If I started the car after 3 days and drove 3 miles,
the smoke left the alternator. A weak battery fried the 61 amp
alternator...
I discovered it was something in the passenger's seat belt
release that was draining the battery.

A neighbor had a drain that would take 2 weeks to drain the
battery.

It turned out to be the tiny light in the passenger mirror was
causing the issue. It was only a few milliamps, but over time
that drained batteries..

I've seen new alternators have a small parasitic drain, ma. So I
run the 2 small wires on the alternator through the switch.

Voltage regulators on riding mowers are good at draining the
battery.

BTY
I discovered the spark plugs in my 2007 GMC 120k miles are the
original plugs. New ones are in the mail along with a new delco
cap. The plug gap measured 0.055. Go figure why the gap wasn't
0.060?
I plan to remove the vent screens on the distributor.
I hope the distributor lasts more than 3 years..

 

[jimg.allentown]

A battery disconnect has a few disadvantages:

1) In areas with emission inspections, it is not usable. Car has to be driven for a period of time for the monitor buffers to come into a 'ready' state. Emission test will fail until READY for the test.

2) Modern car ECMs have adaptive programming that adapts to your particular driving style. This amounts to 'learning' idle and running strategy. This also extends to fuel usage and mileage. In short, disconnecting the battery frequently can cause lousy gas mileage and probably stalling at inconvenient times.

 

[Gomer]

I wonder if using that type switch close to the battery terminal would be safe. Sparks could cause trouble.

 

[Mike(NEOhio)]

I had a '97 grand cherokee that would drain overnight. It would go for months with no trouble or do it two or three time in a row. I traced it down
to the interior lights circuit. Never could get beyond that and figured it was in the body control module. I ended up just leaving the fuse out.

 

[Hobo,NC]

(quoted from post at 14:49:43 03/26/22) Son in laws Honda Pilot was leaking in
the same area. Did you have to pull the
windshield ?

Not YET if I have to go there its sand blasted I don't have a problem replacing it. I could not find the leak it was that small I sprayed it with foot power it would get damp on the inside left corner of the windshield. Nothing I could do proved the seal of the windshield was compromised.

I googled windshield replacement for info on how to get the trim off. When off the crack in the putty they sealed it off with jumped out at me. Also in the video they bragged about going the extra mile to seal that crack :idea: I may have to do more to it if so at least I will be ready for it. Just figuring out how the inside and outside trim comes apart was time consuming.

 

[Bill(Wis)]

Not any different than disconnecting a battery cable. You do realize that this switch is connected to the negative post (negative ground system)?

 

[Bill(Wis)]

Hmmm. My 2011 Tundra was equipped with this type of switch. Used it every time I left the truck sit for any length of time. Registered and licensed in New Jersey which is a super Nanny State when it comes to emissions testing. Never failed. My son has that truck now with about 450,000 miles on it. My 2017 Tundra is registered in Wisconsin, so no emission test is required. It's sitting in the shed right now with the battery disconnected as has been the case for the last 5 years. Every time I leave the farm for more than a day I disconnect it. Never a problem with gas mileage, rough running, etc. It acts like it had never been disconnected. I used one of these on my Kubota M6800 for 20 years. Same battery. Never a problem. Same goes for John Deere 125M and a Case IH 125 Maxxum. I keep all those batteries disconnected with this type of switch when not in use. Here are some pics of that 20 year old battery. I couldn't get that same battery from Kubota so I replaced it with a John Deere.

 

[Hobo,NC]

Sprint 6 I have a Infrared Smart Phone Flir its been a real pain the battery will not stay charged from day one I should have sent it back. My tool man offered to trade me out of it as all he had sold had the same problem. Nothing he had on the truck would compare to the flir so I live with the battery issue. I have done the update suggested by flir they know it was a issue. What are you using my plans are to get a dedicated hand held Flir to get away from the smart phone issue. $$$$ where does it end : (

For the others your imagination is the only limit of its use. A guy a few weeks ago showed how he found a noisy slipping belt with a flir before he touched it. In my case having to fiddle with the one I have slows the process down if I forget to charge the battery are have to wait for it to load and go to work its frustrating. I WANT A DETACATED TOOL : )

What are you using.

This post was edited by Hobo,NC on 03/26/2022 at 07:02 am.

 

[JMOR]

(quoted from post at 08:58:59 03/26/22) HoBo
I had a 2 door Cadillac, 1960's,. It took 4 days to drain the
battery. If I started the car after 3 days and drove 3 miles,
the smoke left the alternator. A weak battery fried the 61 amp
alternator...
I discovered it was something in the passenger's seat belt
release that was draining the battery.

A neighbor had a drain that would take 2 weeks to drain the
battery.

It turned out to be the tiny light in the passenger mirror was
causing the issue. It was only a few milliamps, but over time
that drained batteries..

I've seen new alternators have a small parasitic drain, ma. So I
run the 2 small wires on the alternator through the switch.

Voltage regulators on riding mowers are good at draining the
battery.

BTY
I discovered the spark plugs in my 2007 GMC 120k miles are the
original plugs. New ones are in the mail along with a new delco
cap. The plug gap measured 0.055. Go figure why the gap wasn't
0.060?
I plan to remove the vent screens on the distributor.
I hope the distributor lasts more than 3 years..

eo, I don't know your specific alternator, but I do know that GM 10SI alternators have a 750 microampere "parasitic" drain, by design. The sense circuit (terminal 2) is always powered and feeding the alternator VR. 750 microamperes will need about 9 years to totally discharge even a small 66 amp-hour battery, so most need not worry. Of course, some years before a total discharge, it will be too depleted to operate the starter. Still, not much concern.

 

[WilBury]

Maybe a "real" tech can confirm this...
I had 2 early 2000's F150s with parasitic draw. What fixed 'em was new batteries.

 

[JMOR]

(quoted from post at 10:46:52 03/26/22) Maybe a "real" tech can confirm this...
I had 2 early 2000's F150s with parasitic draw. What fixed 'em was new batteries.

f new batteries fixed the drain, then I say the drain was within the batteries & not in truck's circuitry. Did you measure the drain by inserting an ammeter between battery post and cable?

 

[WilBury]

I did. As I recall, the draw was pretty low but definitely coming from the truck.
I know there is a timer that draws for a little while before shutting off but the batteries would just not hold over a few days.

This post was edited by WilBury on 03/26/2022 at 08:19 am.

 

[GordoSD]

Corvettes are notorious for padasite drain I use a battery maintainer. A lot of them don't get
driven more than several times a month. And not ever in winter.
It's so nad the 2021 came with a Corvette logod maintainer in the baggage area.

 

[J.Wondergem]

(quoted from post at 09:22:02 03/26/22) I wonder if using that type switch close to the battery terminal would be safe. Sparks could cause trouble.

Mine don't have sparks.

 

[ASEguy]

Garage guru's had a piece written up on finding drains with an infrared. I like the idea on larger drains, but small ones?

 

[jimg.allentown]

Well, just maybe he left it live long enough for the monitors to reach a ready state when the emissions test was coming up. I know it would not work here in PA unless you left it 'live' for long enough to pass. That feature was part of the OBD2 system to prevent folks from just disconnecting the battery to get rid of hard faults long enough to pass.

Also, your information is ANECDOTAL. Perhaps true in YOUR case, but maybe not in every case. Some cars are more tolerant than others. Programming does vary from year to year and manufacturer to manufacturer.

 

[MARK ROBKE]

Am I reading your meter wrong- it looks like you are on AMP scale, not MILLIAMP? With all due respect. If so,
it would have been .175amps and now .03 amps. I never bothered with milliamps on a draw, but anything over a
tenth of an amp I did check. Mark.

 

[Hobo,NC]

I think 200ma is all the ma scale will read so while I am waiting for it to power down I leave it in the amp scale. It has to do with a good meter something to do with how may zero's with scale it down to. It auto scales it I read .030 on my meter as 30 tho of a amp... 0.175 is 175 tho.

Edit

If I were reading 1amp the meter will show 1.000 if I were reading 1.5 amps it would read 1.500 if I were reading 175ma it would read 0.175. I think this is a 6 digit meter maybe 5, you pay for what you get. I brought this one around 1990 it cost $400. It was hammered into you, you needed a low impedance meter are you could damage the electronics. . I have beat it to death I have always been able to fix it. I have other meters that are more expensive I am conferrable with this one its my first pick out of the bunch.

I like this one for drains my battery is dyeing run time 30min. I have not priced the battery I spec its $300.00.

If I don't find the drain and have to dig in the blind someone else will dig I have got to old to do dash work are under dash work. The hardest part getting folks to LEAVE IT, 99% of the time there is no excessive drain they have to leave it to take the guess out.


This post was edited by Hobo,NC on 03/26/2022 at 04:26 pm.

 

[Geo-TH,In]

Jessie,
In theory it might take years.
In reality I've seen a tiny bulb in the visor mirror drain of a
chevy truck drain the battery in 2 weeks. The battery may have
been good enough to start the truck and at the end of its life.
IMO, If I can stop a battery drain, I will, especially in the
winter when a battery tends to self discharge..
I've seen a new mower battery go dead sitting 6 months in warm
weather.

Each to their own...I try to stop parasitic drains...

 

[JMOR]

(quoted from post at 17:22:40 03/26/22) Jessie,
In theory it might take years.
In reality I've seen a tiny bulb in the visor mirror drain of a
chevy truck drain the battery in 2 weeks. The battery may have
been good enough to start the truck and at the end of its life.
IMO, If I can stop a battery drain, I will, especially in the
winter when a battery tends to self discharge..
I've seen a new mower battery go dead sitting 6 months in warm
weather.

Each to their own...I try to stop parasitic drains...

othing wrong with that. Lower the better.

 

[dbNga]

Wife's '04 Infiniti fx35 will drain battery down over weekend if windows are left halfway down.

 

[Hobo,NC]

Tiny bulb most common is a 194, a 194 draws .27 amps (1/4 amp)
.27 X 24 hours = 6.48 amps. The most common battery is 110RC divide 6.48 into 110 = 16.98 days.


It gets more interesting when you are dealing with .030ma. in theory it should take 152 days plus. With used/aged Equitment I divide it by 4 = 38 days. Anything under I go on a search for any possible problem in the starting charging electrical system. Anything over its life in general deal with it.

If your vehicle sets 38 days at a time you need to get out more
: ) are put them on rotation.

 

[Hobo,NC]

I would look into a power window relearn. On most you hold the master switch down 5 sec after its down and repeat 5 sec. after its up. Perform on all window switches in the master.

Sounds crazy but it works.