Farm Bill thoughts

[rrlund]

First off,let me ask a hand full of you who's opinion of modern ag and the government is already well known,to start your own post if you want to go in to your predictable rant. Thank you.

Now,Senator Pat Roberts was interviewed on TV this morning giving a bushel basket of reasons why he was going to vote against the Farm Bill in the Senate. Speaking for myself,I really don't know what's in it. I'm just glad it's over with because I'm more than tired of the ag media's obsession with it. All it means to me is the loss of the $1100 a year DCP payment that they've been threatening to take away since the 95 Farm Bill,so I don't have a horse in this race. There would have to be a total disaster,probably on a statewide scale before I could collect from the Livestock Indemnity program.

Any of the rest of you who will be effected by it,do you know for sure what's in it and how it will effect you,good or bad?
http://cjonline.com/news/state/2014 01 30/four us house members roberts pan farm bill

 

[donjr]

Biggest thing I winced at was in a local rag that the SNAP program had a bunch of bucks cut out of it. Article said that SNAP was $36.6 billion in 2008, and after the cuts to it will ONLY be $76.6 billion next year, after having 6% cut out of it.... Nice, fuzzy math!!!!

 

[rrlund]

Well......that's my thought about most of it. They talk about what it does over 10 years,but it's only a five year bill. You have to wonder if they plan for the next one to be five years late instead of two. That was the trouble with taking away direct payments in the 95 bill. It left them in for the duration,but when they wrote the next one,they were right back.

 

[notjustair]

To us who are farmers or those who had parents as farmers, the word "farm" means something. With urbanization and more folks whose connection to farming is outside the reach of their memory, that word means very little. The closest most of them will ever get to "farm" is when they leave their money at Whole Paycheck Foods. They could care less about anything in government that has "farm" in it. Even if help for the underprivileged is lumped in (regardless of whether I agree with that or not).

We won't get support for things farm related until people really have to pay the actual price for food and see what a farm gives them. It's sad when people have to pay MORE to buy a butcher hog or cow right from my pen and process it than they would if they went to the store and bought that meat.

"You get what you pay for" means very little in today's world.

 

[Anonymous-0]

Its all about controll.. :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:
They have to give $$ to controll the sheep,, :wink:
Foods a big thing ya know 8) 8)
Ya got a have it 3 times a day :shock: :shock: :shock:
Every danged day..

 

[LonM]

From what I gather, the new farm bill failed to address the mandatory country of origin labeling issue. The WTO says we are in violation of free trade rules under the current COOL program, and by failing to change anything for the new farm bill, Canada and Mexico will be able to charge retaliatory import tariffs on US beef. This could be an issue for US cattle producers since Mexico and Canada buy a fair bit of our beef. In addition, the controversial GIPSA rule was not addressed in the new farm bill either. As we all know from experience, something has to wreck the record-high cattle market....
Lon

 

[LonM]

PS: I got that info at www.dailylivestockreport.com from the January 28th newsletter.
Lon

 

[rrlund]

Ya I know NCBA is in opposition to it. They say cool is costing us cattlemen $60 a head. I don't know. It sounded like a good and simple idea,but I think it came around to bite us.

 

[LonM]

I think COOL was a good idea, but was never given the authority it needed to work. I also think the NCBA has their interests in working more for the big feedlots and packers than it does for the family-sized cattle outfits.

 

[rrlund]

I think that's the way it is with most commodity organizations today. I pay dues to Michigan Cattlemens Association for what they do in Lansing and with MSU research and the bull testing,but I'm not a member of NCBA anymore. I just didn't see where I was getting anything for my money. They don't seem to get much of what they ask for in DC.

 

[John_PA]

I did not see nor hear what happened with the new bill as far as the machinery purchasing bonus depreciation and other portions pertaining to new and used equipment purchases.

I'm a little upset about how the focus of everyone's attention is on the SNAP portion of the bill. I don't care to hear anyone talk about food stamps ever again. I never took a direct payment, ever. I worked 3 jobs, sometimes sleeping in my car, but I never took a dime. That portion doesn't affect me. However, if these people want to get lean and keep the farmers from getting any kind of subsidies, then get rid of the SNAP program as it exists. After all, it is just a backdoor subsidy for farmers, right? The government spends tens of billions of dollars on food, and it was included in the farm bill because it was a way to help those get food, and help farmers.

However, I don't believe it belongs in the farm bill at all anymore. It doesn't specifically help farmers in the US anymore, therefore is irrelevant. Anyone with a SNAP access card can buy fresh produce and other food products that were imported from another country. This should be a separate program entirely to keep the farm bill pure.

The only thing I want out of the farm bill is the ability to farm freely, as an American, in a free market economy, for profit, and not have my government interfere with my safe and responsible farming practices. I am not an idiot and I don't need someone to hold my hand and tell me what to do. The government believes we would all forget to breathe if they didn't tell us how and when to do it. I don't need that. I don't need anyone to tell me what I can and can't do.

I am, however, more than happy to have information provided by agriculture colleges concerning research funded by said government, about agriculture practices that are cutting edge and necessary to continue to profit further and be safe and responsible.

 

[Alan K]

How true. Farming used to be a way of life for the majority of the population....to those who left it became a four letter word, now it seems to almost be a third world country...something so far removed from anything.

 

[rrlund]

"I did not see nor hear what happened with the new bill as far as the machinery purchasing bonus depreciation and other portions pertaining to new and used equipment purchases."

I don't think that's exclusive to ag is it? I believe that will have to be addressed in tax law.
Everybody seems to think it will be by the end of the year.

 

[John_PA]

" On May 22, 2008, Congress passed The Food, Conservation and Energy Act of 2008 (also known as The Farm Bill). This law allows special bonus depreciation under section 1400N(d) of the Code. "


picked that off the internet quickly.

I remember being excited couple years ago when I could get a nice used corn planter from the money I didn't have to pay in taxes because I bought a tractor that had bonus depreciation for the first year.

I'm not saying I evade taxes. I'm saying that I am thankful for every opportunity I get to keep the money I earn.


Right now in Pennsylvania, locally, gasoline is $3.599 a gallon. Diesel fuel is $4.499 a gallon. 44 9/10 cent road tax just got a buddy in the form of separate road tax that add 9 cents per gallon to gas, but 13 cents per gallon to diesel fuel.

The bulk of new construction and repairs is not happening in any rural areas, but closer to the city of Pittsburgh and all the shopping centers that surround it. It's like I have to pay so other people can shop. Nifty...

 

[rrlund]

OK. A drop from half a million to $25,000 is quite a cut though. I wouldn't be too surprised to see something amended eventually to put it somewhere in the middle,but.......with as long as it took just to get this bill,all bets are off.

 

[LonM]

A farm bill without some form of food assistance program would never get past the first committee. Those sort of programs are included in the bill so that it gets enough votes to become law. Farmers have been minorities for a long time; our interests come secondary. I also read that with the new bill, there will be closer scrutiny over absentee "farmers" cashing large subsidy checks. I farm for a living, but would rather see the needy get fed versus a big shot operator get federal money from the rest of us when he/she can make do without it.
Lon

 

[Dean]

Why should a majority of US taxpayers pay other US taxpayers to do or not do something?

Dean

 

[rrlund]

If I had to hazard a guess it would be because this is the year 2014 not 1814 and that's the country we live in these days. All the complaining in the world ain't gonna turn the clock back that far.

 

[paul]

One pen swipe and the govt can kill the grain market, as Nixon and Carter both did. It took until the drought of the late 1980s to recover from that, the damage done to rural America.

As well. A safety net for disaster will help keep a more diverse, strong rural ecconomy and crop and food prices. It doesn't need to be what we have, and sure doesnt need to be what we had a few decades ago, but some sort of safety net, which would compare to the subsidies other industries get, or compare to the labor regulations and minimum wage laws workers have, seems to be a good idea?

The farm program will break down into the chart I hopefully can post here.

Note that less than 5% of it goes directly to farmers.

Less than 10% of it goes to insurance companies which does help farmers, but doesn't go to them directly. Farmers need to add more money in order to get anything from this, and they are private insurance programs not a govt pile of money. The govt just pays part of the premiums is all.

And about 6% goes to hunting and wildlife and tree hugging groups in the form of renting poorer land from farmers to create wildlife habitat. Now setting aside this land out of crop production does help keep ag prices up a tad, but again the money comes with a lot of strings to plant and maintain a special crop of approved native habitat, and control weeds. It is not free money to farmers, it gives access to the hunting and save the planet folks.

The big blue part is what goes to food stamps/ snap/ school lunches/ etc to subsidies the poor. Not to farmers.

So when you bad mouth the whole deal and you certainly may, be sure you understand what money you are talking about, and who you are really after?


As to what is in the program for farmers specifically, it is a 500+ page document, we likely don't have a clue. And, while both the house and senate passed it, they are different versions so it is still far from official, they need to compromise it together yet.

Big business and big govt has said for years they prefer an insurance program over disaster payments so they can budget easier for them, so that is what we are getting. More crop insurance subsidies, less of all the other types of programs.

Remember now, the blue area goes to poor people welfare, the green portion goes to farmers, tell us again where the problem is and where the money disappears to?

Paul

 

[T in NE]

That"s how government math works. When you "cut" spending, you are really spending less than you were planning to spend, not much much you actually spend.

Like saying you are cutting spending next year, so you buy a $50,000 tractor instead of the $60,000 tractor you wanted.

 

[rrlund]

Ya,the government uses what's called "baseline budgeting". A cut is actually a reduction in the scheduled increase.

 

[Jon Hagen]

"Why should a majority of US taxpayers pay other US taxpayers to do or not do something?
Dean "



Dean, I am supprised that you can't comprehend what a Simple and good working deal the food security act(AKA farm bill) has been for the US and world population.

It is simply a pact between the American farmer and the American public, where in exchange for a few cents of your food dollar, You agree to help protect the farmer from a weather /crop failure/ low market price disaster, and the farmer agrees to grow as much or little of whatever food crop you need, for an assured but minimum cost.

That way the farmer can grow a high risk, low profit food for you because the farmer knows you will support him during a disaster that would otherwise put him out of business.

This system has kept the last and best (2% of the US population) of farms in business while providing the entire population of the US twice over (about 700 million people) with a very stable supply of good food for the lowest cost of any country in the world.

As to why would you pay a farmer not to grow a specific crop ?
Once again it is a pact between ther American people and the farmer.
When you have a rare year or two where weather and all other farming conditions have been near perfect, you will get more of that crop than you need, a surplus, and the crop sells for less than the cost of production. The farmer thinks wow, that crop is so cheap that I cant make any profit on it, so I won't grow it next year and to cut costs, I will get rid of the land and specialized equippment I need to grow that crop.
The government knows the surplus of that food will not last long and want the farmers to maintain the capacity to grow more of that crop in the future, so they make another pact with the farmer. The government says, we don't need any more of that crop right now, so we will pay you enough to pay your bills while that land and machinery is idle. That way the farmer is able to make ends meet while that crop is not produced, and in exchange the government and American people have everything in place to produce more of that crop on short notice before supplies run out. A workable and good deal for both the producers and consumers.

This simple low cost system has kept the US and much of the world well fed at little cost for over 60 years. It's simple and it works.

 

[Eldon (WA)]

(quoted from post at 18:40:44 02/01/14) "Why should a majority of US taxpayers pay other US taxpayers to do or not do something?
Dean "



Dean, I am supprised that you can't comprehend what a Simnple and good working deal the food security act(AKA farm bill) has been for the US and world population.

It is simply a pact between the American farmer and the American public, where in exchange for a few cents of your food dollar, You agree to help protect the farmer from a weather /crop failure/ low market price disaster, and the farmer agrees to grow as much or little of whatever food crop you need, for an assured but minimum cost.

That way the farmer can grow a high risk, low profit food for you because the farmer knows you will support him during a disaster that would otherwise put him out of business.

This system has kept the last and best (2% of the US population) of farms in business while providing the entire population of the US twice over (about 700 million people) with a very stable supply of good food for the lowest cost of any country in the world.

As to why would you pay a farmer not to grow a specific crop ?
Once again it is a pact between ther American people and the farmer.
When you have a rare year where weather and all other farming conditions have been near perfect, you will get more of that crop than you need, a surplus, and the crop sells for less than the cost of production. The farmer thinks wow, that crop is so cheap that I cant make any profit on it, so I won't grow it next year and to cut costs, I will get rid of the land and specialized equippment I need to grow that crop.
The government knows the surplus of that food will not last long and want the farmers to maintain the capacity to grow more of that crop in the future, so they make another pact with the farmer. The government says, we don't need any more of that crop right now, so we will pay you enough to pay your bills while that land and machinery is idle. That way the farmer is able to make ends meet while that crop is not produced, and in exchange the government and american people have everything in place to produce more of that crop on short notice before supplies run out. A workable and good deal for both the producers and consumers.

This simple low costy system has kept the US and much of the world well fed at little cost for over 60 years. It's simple and it works.

Alas! It is a mega CSA!!

 

[Bret4207]

I know this much about the "Farm Bill"- 80% of it is food stamps. That part should be it's own bill, not related to agriculture. The ag part does not directly benefit or affect me at all as far as my farm goes. It's a non-issue to me. I'm too small to benefit, too poor to matter.