Can someone help me find a fuel filter part number?

[BarnyardEngineering]

View attachment 75646


Here you can see the filter housing in questions. That bore is what the filter has to go in, and it has to have room to allow the o ring to spread out. Arguably, the Baldwin that was in it was tight, but not so tight I had to hammer it in. Adding an O ring, which increases the diameter even more, will result in destruction of the filter element.

Hammer and filter should not be in the same sentence, or paragraph.

 

[DoubleO7]

I had an idea to get a different filter and fabricate a spring and washer to hold the filter down but then started leaning toward just sizing the metal of my new filters to be tight, and getting a much thinner o-ring to make it work.

I was thinking the same thing as you. Find a filter that wil fit best inside the cover. Big hole on the bottom and smaller hole on top.

Maybe machine a flanged aluminum sleeve that has the flange in the middle. Lower dia. goes into the cast iron and the upper dia. is sized to go into bottom of filter. Put a thin rubber washer on each side of flange. Might need another flanged sleeve and rubber washer on top of filter.
Then your spring deal on top of the top flaged washer and the existing bolt.

Now the filter is sealed on each end and no o-ring needed.

Use the Wix filter finder by size webpage to find a suitable filter. Determine the maximum height that will fit under the dome will give you more filters to work with.

Filter Finder

www.wixfilters.com

Jim Becker's post below rang a bell...... cut the the filter off where the o-ring is, toss o-ring.
Use a rubber washer that fits good over the remaining sleeve and is no bigger dia. then the bored boss it goes into.
Then a spring on top around the bolt to keep filter pushed down.
Done

 

[Janicholson]

There is NO SPRING OR SLEEVE. The filter is held in place in its base by friction and the o-ring. Fuel lines all go in and out through the bottom. The bolt on top you have circled is the bleeder, built into the long bolt. In the filter base photo close up, the fuel enters into the outer ring or cavity, and the entire vessel is filled with fuel, and it is drawn through the filter into the center cavity and out that fuel line.

I had an idea to get a different filter and fabricate a spring and washer to hold the filter down but then started leaning toward just sizing the metal of my new filters to be tight, and getting a much thinner o-ring to make it work. I’m not in a hurry and I’ve kind of been beating my head against a wall for new ideas, I’m confident they will come. Where there’s a will there’s a way. Most of my antique projects require some degree of fiddling. You can see my new not so pretty fuel lines on the tractor. They do work through.

Take the available filter, and the filter housing base to a machune shop and have it bored to the appropriate size. si==Simple permanent. mark the filter housing with the filter that fits. it is not sacred, Jim

 

[DoubleO7]

Take the available filter, and the filter housing base to a machune shop and have it bored to the appropriate size. si==Simple permanent. mark the filter housing with the filter that fits. it is not sacred, Jim

Would be WAY better to find a WAY more common filter. One that is not only made by one manufacturer and only available fom an overseas seller. And since they can not reliably replicate an original equipment filter as proven here, no way could you expect the next batch of filters to be off spec in the future.

 

[Jim Becker]

Take the available filter, and the filter housing base to a machune shop and have it bored to the appropriate size. si==Simple permanent. mark the filter housing with the filter that fits. it is not sacred, Jim

It seems improbable to me that there are two different part numbers for two different filters that are that close to identical. I guess the non-fitting filters are the right number but have simply been manufactured out of spec. If so, boring out the base for the defective filters will result in the reverse problem when they fix the manufacturing problem. If I was going to modify something, it would be the defective filter. I would probably hacksaw a cut up to the o-ring, then force the filter in to the point the o-ring is pressed against the base. Just keep the trash from the sawing out of the filter.

I see that as I was typing this, Double07 made the same assessment of the problem.

 

[DoubleO7]

@brazodog

Have you considered crimping the filter inlet like a furnace duct?
To make it smaller.

 

[Fritz Maurer]

You have plenty of surface area on the filter base … find a filter with comparable body dimensions and no spigot at all. Put a spring under the cover , pushing down on the filter, and you’re in.

 

[kshansen]

I agree with all suggesting finding a common filter that is close and then making an adapter to let it seal.

The other option would be to replace the two filter heads with ones that accept common spin-on filters. Like something that was used on a 4-71 or 4-53 Detroit Diesel. Only problem with that is from what I see these days they are asking crazy prices for a simple filter head, $75 to $100! Now if you are lucky enough to have an off-road equipment junk yard or old over the road truck junk yard near by you could probably find a pair for next to nothing. Those filter heads will take various length filters so if you can find a pair with too long a filter grab them and do some research to find a shorter filter.

 

[brazosdog]

All, I think I have this figured out. There were several suggestions in this thread and the other that led to the solution. Also, the manufacturer is checking to see if there is an issue with this batch of filters. I will post the final solution to making this one work Shortly, but suffice it to say my hydraulic shop with the hydraulic press was the ticket along with a change to a considerably smaller and thinner O-ring.

That is far too big to jam into filter base. Also, because of the way, the O-ring seat on the filter itself is set up, the O-ring will simply roll out as you install it. There is no way to get into Force. So, the solution, is to use an O-ring that is about half the diameter of the original O-ring cross-section, and also one that is considerably smaller that must be stretched across the filter. This results in , a O-ring that has far more cavity space to squish out into, and makes just enough contact to seat.

The final dimensions that they hydraulic shop crimped this to is 1.59 to 1.60 inches. Without the O-ring this filter drops right in. With the proper O-ring dimension, it fits tight enough.

I will put these notes in the OP for someone else in case they run across the same issue. However, I strongly encourage using a micrometer to measure your filter base prior to crimping. These old tractors probably had massive swingsin sizing and it’s entirely possible that this filter would fit as in someone else. Either way, the size is just a hair over and crapping it down will preserve the integrity of the filter and allow it to fit if you get the right O-ring squished in it.


I still don’t have the proper O-ring to make it work yet. I’m working on that problem. This is what I call a generational diesel filter….just change it once a generation because it’s a pain in the neck.

 

[BarnyardEngineering]

It seems improbable to me that there are two different part numbers for two different filters that are that close to identical. I guess the non-fitting filters are the right number but have simply been manufactured out of spec. If so, boring out the base for the defective filters will result in the reverse problem when they fix the manufacturing problem. If I was going to modify something, it would be the defective filter. I would probably hacksaw a cut up to the o-ring, then force the filter in to the point the o-ring is pressed against the base. Just keep the trash from the sawing out of the filter.

I see that as I was typing this, Double07 made the same assessment of the problem.

Odds are slim to none that the manufacturer will ever fix the "manufacturing problem." They would have to acknowledge the problem in the first place, and in my experience manufacturers just assume you're too stupid to use their product, rather than admit to a problem. The demand for these filters is clearly extremely low, given that the OP had to order a filter from France. They're not going to make a design change for a run of a few dozen filters. That's assuming they ever make any more.

 

[DoubleO7]

That's assuming they ever make any more.

They likely have a shipping container from China to sell off before they (maybe) might order more with correct dimensions.

 

[brazosdog]

You have plenty of surface area on the filter base … find a filter with comparable body dimensions and no spigot at all. Put a spring under the cover , pushing down on the filter, and you’re in.

I

Would be WAY better to find a WAY more common filter. One that is not only made by one manufacturer and only available fom an overseas seller. And since they can not reliably replicate an original equipment filter as proven here, no way could you expect the next batch of filters to be off spec in the future.

i agree. However, I only need a few filters. These will last me my lifetime and the odds of this tractor being used again after me are nearly zero. After I am done, it will sit in the pasture and eventually be scrapped like all of the previous tractors on our place. Just a fact of life.

Plus, this is a diesel filter. I think I've changed my daily use tractor diesel filter twice in 1000 hours. Judging by the fact this filter isn't a fine mesh filter, I'm not convinced it's even necessary.

 

[brazosdog]

OK, Here is the fix for this:

Wix 33114 is the secondary and that is still made.

The primary fuel filter is a 840633R91 which crosses to HiFi Filter SN 21036, this is the one this whole thread is about.

1.) Measure your filter base bore. Mine was 1.624" - The Gates Hydraulic hose press is what my guy used. He simply took my measurements and used the right die and crushed down the original filter. See pics. He was able to use my old filter as a guide to make adjustments, and then just stick my filter in and let the machine go. I crimped mine down to 1.59-1.6".

2.) Discard the O-Ring that comes with the filter, it's OD when installed is far too big. I don't know what o-ring my hydraulic guy got, but it's close to a 122 Buna O-Ring. This is a fair bit smaller ID than the filter protrusion, so you will have to 'stretch' it over a little bit. Once you do that, the filter will go into the bore, but you may need to 'fiddle' with the O-ring as you install and use a pick to keep the O-ring seated as you press it down.

That's what I ended up doing, and it fits.

I cannot update my OP any longer, so this will have to do.

 

[kshansen]

Just did a quick search on HiFi Filter SN 21036. I have to wonder if the filter medium used is woven out of gold thread! Think one site is asking close to $90.00 for a filter that should sell for under ten dollars!

Glad you managed to find someone who could modify your filter to fit.

 

[Fritz Maurer]

OK, Here is the fix for this:

Wix 33114 is the secondary and that is still made.

The primary fuel filter is a 840633R91 which crosses to HiFi Filter SN 21036, this is the one this whole thread is about.

1.) Measure your filter base bore. Mine was 1.624" - The Gates Hydraulic hose press is what my guy used. He simply took my measurements and used the right die and crushed down the original filter. See pics. He was able to use my old filter as a guide to make adjustments, and then just stick my filter in and let the machine go. I crimped mine down to 1.59-1.6".

2.) Discard the O-Ring that comes with the filter, it's OD when installed is far too big. I don't know what o-ring my hydraulic guy got, but it's close to a 122 Buna O-Ring. This is a fair bit smaller ID than the filter protrusion, so you will have to 'stretch' it over a little bit. Once you do that, the filter will go into the bore, but you may need to 'fiddle' with the O-ring as you install and use a pick to keep the O-ring seated as you press it down.

That's what I ended up doing, and it fits.

I cannot update my OP any longer, so this will have to do.

View attachment 75885View attachment 75886

I really wanted to see what it looked like when it came out of there.

 

[used red MN]

OK, Here is the fix for this:

Wix 33114 is the secondary and that is still made.

The primary fuel filter is a 840633R91 which crosses to HiFi Filter SN 21036, this is the one this whole thread is about.

1.) Measure your filter base bore. Mine was 1.624" - The Gates Hydraulic hose press is what my guy used. He simply took my measurements and used the right die and crushed down the original filter. See pics. He was able to use my old filter as a guide to make adjustments, and then just stick my filter in and let the machine go. I crimped mine down to 1.59-1.6".

2.) Discard the O-Ring that comes with the filter, it's OD when installed is far too big. I don't know what o-ring my hydraulic guy got, but it's close to a 122 Buna O-Ring. This is a fair bit smaller ID than the filter protrusion, so you will have to 'stretch' it over a little bit. Once you do that, the filter will go into the bore, but you may need to 'fiddle' with the O-ring as you install and use a pick to keep the O-ring seated as you press it down.

That's what I ended up doing, and it fits.

I cannot update my OP any longer, so this will have to do.

View attachment 75885View attachment 75886

His other post“I wonder if you could find someone with a hydraulic hose crimping tool that has the correct size jaws that could just squeeze that part a little smaller for you?” Humm, wonder who suggested that?
Glad it worked out. I agree It would be interesting to see what that filter neck looked like after the modification.

 

[Duner Wi]

Thank you for the end of the story.

 

[caterpillar guy]

For a new spin on filter base Baldwin makes or sells bases for all sorts of filters and bases. Now if you just bolt a plate on the block like I said in the other reply you can then bolt a base on to accommodate A newer spin on filter for this of your choosing or that is readly available form a source close to you. The BF957 is an old long line Cummins fuel filter and the BF 584 is an old long time Cat fuel filter that would work for a final. Or you can soruce bases from other places such as junkyards for Deere equipment with the box filters easy to change and get for many models of equipment for many years. I believe you will find you need to have the spring pressure on the filter so it doesn't bounce up and allow dirt to pass by the filter at the base also they were with the spring to hold the top tight against leaks there also since they have a seal of sorts there be it just the paper ends or the rubber seals on them.

 

[brazosdog]

For a new spin on filter base Baldwin makes or sells bases for all sorts of filters and bases. Now if you just bolt a plate on the block like I said in the other reply you can then bolt a base on to accommodate A newer spin on filter for this of your choosing or that is readly available form a source close to you. The BF957 is an old long line Cummins fuel filter and the BF 584 is an old long time Cat fuel filter that would work for a final. Or you can soruce bases from other places such as junkyards for Deere equipment with the box filters easy to change and get for many models of equipment for many years. I believe you will find you need to have the spring pressure on the filter so it doesn't bounce up and allow dirt to pass by the filter at the base also they were with the spring to hold the top tight against leaks there also since they have a seal of sorts there be it just the paper ends or the rubber seals on them.

It's a good idea, but a cursory search did not yield any 'easy' fixes. This is diesel. So, the filter base needs to be on top and the spin on needs to screw on from bottom. Filter base needs to have bleeder screws. It also needs to serve for water separation AND filtration. The OEM filter base we are discussing incorporates the water separator bowl and the primary fuel filter. Then, it would need to have 1/2" compressions style inlet and outlet.

Now is a good time to find this as I have 2 working fuel filters now that will last me decades.

I prefer your solution as it would eliminate the leaky primary fuel filter housing which is a pain to seal, and it would eliminate the leaky water separator which is a pain to seal.