Case 530 CK parked for 10 years

[TapRackFire]

Looking for some advice on my 530 CK that I picked up the other day. This beast has not run in about 10 years, but I was assured it ran when the PO parked it. The PO let me drag it off for free. Said he only stopped using it b/c it leaked hydraulic fluid everywhere and that is pretty evident by the looks of the back cylinders by the hoe.

I pulled the injectors and flooded the cylinders with Marvel Mystery oil. I waited a few days and rolled the fan blade by hand and the motor turned a little. When I stuck a battery in it and bumped the starter the engine turned without hesitation about 1/4 turn and then STOPPED. I can't get it turn anymore with the starter or the fan blade. I pulled the starter out and tried to roll the flywheel with a bar but I could not get it to turn and it was really hard to get good spot to pry with the loader arms in the way so I put the starter back on and all it does is "click" like it is engaging the flywheel, but it can't overcome whatever is holding the engine.

The motor had the air cleaner and exhaust stack tightly attached so the motor was no open for water to flood in through those two places.
I jacked one of the rear tires off the ground and put the tractor in 4th and rocked that tire till I was sick of it. All I heard was a clicking sound in the axle. I never could get any results with the rear wheel regardless of the gear I chose, to include neutral. I thought I had a good chance of using the rear wheel as leverage to turn the engine, but I was wrong.

This unit does have a torque converter and a directive drive selector on the steering wheel. Does this require me to do something special to get this motor to rotate by hand?

I was thinking about removing the hydraulic pump from the front of the engine so I could have access to the front of the engine to install something to the crankshaft that would allow me to rotate the motor at least backward 1/4 of a turn and try working the engine back and forth.

Any suggestion?

Tap

 

[Mark-Ia]

Pull the valve cover and check for stuck valves.

 

[TapRackFire]

Great idea Mark. I failed to mention I pulled the valve cover and checked the valves. i used a brass hammer and gave them all a lite tap. They were all free except intake valve #3. The rocker arm had it compressed downward/open. I can only assume it is open due to the 1/4 turn of the engine I managed to get before it wouldn't roll over anymore.

 

[used red MN]

Hello TRF welcome to YT! I assume the injectors are still out? An assumed water proof exhaust system never offers any guarantees. So a rusted area at the top of one of the cylinders may likely be your problem. And not to bomb you with bad news but if your injection pump will pump fuel to the cylinders after setting that long you will be enjoying an extreme exception to the rule!

 

[Jim.ME]

Looking for some advice on my 530 CK that I picked up the other day. This beast has not run in about 10 years, but I was assured it ran when the PO parked it. The PO let me drag it off for free. Said he only stopped using it b/c it leaked hydraulic fluid everywhere and that is pretty evident by the looks of the back cylinders by the hoe.

I pulled the injectors and flooded the cylinders with Marvel Mystery oil. I waited a few days and rolled the fan blade by hand and the motor turned a little. When I stuck a battery in it and bumped the starter the engine turned without hesitation about 1/4 turn and then STOPPED. I can't get it turn anymore with the starter or the fan blade. I pulled the starter out and tried to roll the flywheel with a bar but I could not get it to turn and it was really hard to get good spot to pry with the loader arms in the way so I put the starter back on and all it does is "click" like it is engaging the flywheel, but it can't overcome whatever is holding the engine.

The motor had the air cleaner and exhaust stack tightly attached so the motor was no open for water to flood in through those two places.
I jacked one of the rear tires off the ground and put the tractor in 4th and rocked that tire till I was sick of it. All I heard was a clicking sound in the axle. I never could get any results with the rear wheel regardless of the gear I chose, to include neutral. I thought I had a good chance of using the rear wheel as leverage to turn the engine, but I was wrong.

This unit does have a torque converter and a directive drive selector on the steering wheel. Does this require me to do something special to get this motor to rotate by hand?

I was thinking about removing the hydraulic pump from the front of the engine so I could have access to the front of the engine to install something to the crankshaft that would allow me to rotate the motor at least backward 1/4 of a turn and try working the engine back and forth.

Any suggestion?

Tap

The good news is the purchase price was right. You have room to work on it some and not be totally upside down on costs.

The starter would have turned the engine clockwise if viewed standing in front of the tractor. Did you try to turn the flywheel counterclockwise when you had the starter off? As inconvenient as it is, the starter hole maybe your best access for turning it, short of draining the hydraulics (loader frame reservoir I believe) and removing the front pump. Then you will likely need to use the driveshaft for the pump to turn the engine. Make sure the transmission is in neutral.

Another thought is if you are in a cold area any water that got into it could be ice, and preventing it from turning.

 

[TapRackFire]

Thanks Red! I have a bore scope but its too cold to go outside and use it here today in Oklahoma and for about another week. To combat the rust in the top of the cylinder I guess that means I get to pull the head off and remove that rust? What about my idea of removing the hydraulic pump from the front of the motor to ensure the pump is not seized? This would also give me a better place to connect to the crank and try to turn the motor back and forth.

 

[TapRackFire]

Thanks Jim. I did make sure the tractor was in neutral when trying roll it over with the starter or by hand. When i was working on this tractor about a week ago it was about 65 degrees. So I don't think froze water was my problem. The engine did turn clockwise as you indicated. I did try prying that flywheel clock and counter clock wise with no results. But, I don't think I had a very good purchase when trying to do the prying. Those loader arms don't help anything when your trying to pry on that flywheel.

Removing that front pump will create other issues concerning the hydro fluid level in the arms. Don't know the level of hydro fluid in there now.
Can't I remove the pump and the connections to it without creating too much of a hydro fluid mess?

 

[Jim.ME]

Thanks Jim. I did make sure the tractor was in neutral when trying roll it over with the starter or by hand. When i was working on this tractor about a week ago it was about 65 degrees. So I don't think froze water was my problem. The engine did turn clockwise as you indicated. I did try prying that flywheel clock and counter clock wise with no results. But, I don't think I had a very good purchase when trying to do the prying. Those loader arms don't help anything when your trying to pry on that flywheel.

Removing that front pump will create other issues concerning the hydro fluid level in the arms. Don't know the level of hydro fluid in there now.
Can't I remove the pump and the connections to it without creating too much of a hydro fluid mess?

I am pretty sure the loader frame is the reservoir for the front pump. You need to drain the reservoir before removing the pump as the fluid level is above the pump and there are no shutoffs. You will get oil out of the lines on both sides of the pump.

 

[used red MN]

Thanks Red! I have a bore scope but its too cold to go outside and use it here today in Oklahoma and for about another week. To combat the rust in the top of the cylinder I guess that means I get to pull the head off and remove that rust? What about my idea of removing the hydraulic pump from the front of the motor to ensure the pump is not seized? This would also give me a better place to connect to the crank and try to turn the motor back and forth.

The injectors are out?

 

[rustred]

just a suggestion,... have u had someone step on the clutch when trying to turn it backwards? not all that familiar with these but its a suggestion. other thing is you can have rust at the top of a cylinder as with a battery you just made it good and tight!

 

[TapRackFire]

y

The injectors are out?

Yes sir. they are out.

 

[TapRackFire]

just a suggestion,... have u had someone step on the clutch when trying to turn it backwards? not all that familiar with these but its a suggestion. other thing is you can have rust at the top of a cylinder as with a battery you just made it good and tight!

I've tried stepping on the clutch and I don't think it works like a regular clutch is directly connected to the clutch on a car via brackets and metal hardware. The pedal is attached to piston that has hydro pressure lines coming to it and I don't feel any pressure when i push the clutch in. Im not familiar with this style of tranny with a torque converter and directive drive option. Based on the hard lines plumbed into what looks like a square master cylinder where the clutch piston is it seems like i need the motor running or at least turning so the system can have pressure to properly work the clutch. But i'm not sure. I did try turning the elevated wheel in gear and in neutral. I would expect the tractor's diff to be an open carrier and with one wheel elevated and the other on the ground and the tranny in gear I should be able to turn the tranny that is married to the engine and turn the engine. If the tractor is in neutral and it is an open carrier in the diff, I should be able to rotate the wheel.

 

[TapRackFire]

I am pretty sure the loader frame is the reservoir for the front pump. You need to drain the reservoir before removing the pump as the fluid level is above the pump and there are no shutoffs. You will get oil out of the lines on both sides of the pump.

Thanks Jim. You happen to know where that drain is for those loader arms?

 

[Jim.ME]

Thanks Jim. You happen to know where that drain is for those loader arms?

Not offhand. The loader frame isn't that big, look at the underside of the frame arms and towers to find a pipe plug(s). It may well only be on the side the pump suction is on. It might have a drain plug in the base of the tower. If there is a cross over pipe it could have oil in both sides.

 

[rustred]

I've tried stepping on the clutch and I don't think it works like a regular clutch is directly connected to the clutch on a car via brackets and metal hardware. The pedal is attached to piston that has hydro pressure lines coming to it and I don't feel any pressure when i push the clutch in. Im not familiar with this style of tranny with a torque converter and directive drive option. Based on the hard lines plumbed into what looks like a square master cylinder where the clutch piston is it seems like i need the motor running or at least turning so the system can have pressure to properly work the clutch. But i'm not sure. I did try turning the elevated wheel in gear and in neutral. I would expect the tractor's diff to be an open carrier and with one wheel elevated and the other on the ground and the tranny in gear I should be able to turn the tranny that is married to the engine and turn the engine. If the tractor is in neutral and it is an open carrier in the diff, I should be able to rotate the wheel.

i would say yes. i do not believe in that wheel thing. you are going to pull the bottom of the piston off. pistons are made to be hammered on not pulled on from the bottom.

 

[TapRackFire]

i would say yes. i do not believe in that wheel thing. you are going to pull the bottom of the piston off. pistons are made to be hammered on not pulled on from the bottom.

agreed. I'm going to abandon the idea of trying to turn the engine through a rear wheel. I'm going to focus my efforts on removing the pump on the front of the engine so I can gain access to the crank shaft and manufacture some type of adapter to connect to the crank and extend it long enough so i can gain some leverage for working the motor back and forth slowly. With the pump out of the way i may be able to remove the radiator and gain access the crank shaft and be able to turn the motor without building an adapter.

 

[used red MN]

i would say yes. i do not believe in that wheel thing. you are going to pull the bottom of the piston off. pistons are made to be hammered on not pulled on from the bottom.

Rustred, I am going to respectfully disagree. I do agree that cranking a rear wheel back and forth is not the ideal way to break a stuck engine loose. In my opinion if the tractor had a normal manual gear train you could put it in the highest gear. Then you could tie the tractor down to where it couldn’t move. Throw a jerk rope over the top of the tire and take your best shot with your 3/4 ton at jerking the top of the tire backwards. All that would never hurt one of those barrel skirt pistons. If it had partial skirt automotive pistons maybe, but in my opinion still doubtful. The crank stroke would have to be right at the top where it has the most leverage to come close to doing this.

 

[rustred]

Rustred, I am going to respectfully disagree. I do agree that cranking a rear wheel back and forth is not the ideal way to break a stuck engine loose. In my opinion if the tractor had a normal manual gear train you could put it in the highest gear. Then you could tie the tractor down to where it couldn’t move. Throw a jerk rope over the top of the tire and take your best shot with your 3/4 ton at jerking the top of the tire backwards. All that would never hurt one of those barrel skirt pistons. If it had partial skirt automotive pistons maybe, but in my opinion still doubtful. The crank stroke would have to be right at the top where it has the most leverage to come close to doing this.

well i will respectfully disagree with your statement. as i have already proved what i am talking about on a 930 case . got one here with a stuck engine this summer. so the first time in my life it tried this tire shaking think. and guess what. after soaking it with mystery oil for about a week i tryed the starter and the front pully would move 1/8 of an inch with each click. i had my white marks on the pully. so i thought i will jack up the rear wheel and see if i can move it backwards. click the starter ahead then jerk it back. then wow i had one revolution , thought good, i got it free. the oil was shooting out the injector holes except one. put my finger over the hole no compression, wth. pulled the valve cover both them valves are closing good with a gap check also. absolutely no air coming out of that cylinder. put a kleenex up in the injector hole and cranked it over with engine wheeling over good. not a bit of paper movement. so my conclusion is the bottom of the piston broke off at the wrist pin. you have an answer for everything so you tell me what is going on ??? that is the only conclution i can come up with . no piston going up and down equals zero compression. this tractor was a running unit stored in a Quonset for 30 years. i should have know better as i usually tear them down when stuck and do the job correctly. so in spring it has to come apart and i will verify the problem. and jerking the wheel with a truck is asking for big problems.

 

[used red MN]

well i will respectfully disagree with your statement. as i have already proved what i am talking about on a 930 case . got one here with a stuck engine this summer. so the first time in my life it tried this tire shaking think. and guess what. after soaking it with mystery oil for about a week i tryed the starter and the front pully would move 1/8 of an inch with each click. i had my white marks on the pully. so i thought i will jack up the rear wheel and see if i can move it backwards. click the starter ahead then jerk it back. then wow i had one revolution , thought good, i got it free. the oil was shooting out the injector holes except one. put my finger over the hole no compression, wth. pulled the valve cover both them valves are closing good with a gap check also. absolutely no air coming out of that cylinder. put a kleenex up in the injector hole and cranked it over with engine wheeling over good. not a bit of paper movement. so my conclusion is the bottom of the piston broke off at the wrist pin. you have an answer for everything so you tell me what is going on ??? that is the only conclution i can come up with . no piston going up and down equals zero compression. this tractor was a running unit stored in a Quonset for 30 years. i should have know better as i usually tear them down when stuck and do the job correctly. so in spring it has to come apart and i will verify the problem. and jerking the wheel with a truck is asking for big problems.

If you “got one here with a stuck engine this summer” so that means you do not really know the engine condition previously, is that correct? I think I remember you posting pictures of a pair of them you drug in or something like that. My answer would be the lack of compression is from a pre-existing condition. The pick-up and jerk rope was maybe a bit of an exaggeration, got to keep a little Tractor Vet blood circulating here in his absence. I still seriously doubt you can pull the wrist pin out of the bottom of a piston just jerking a tire around by hand. If that was the case this would be the cure for all stuck clutches!

 

[Dieseltech]

If you “got one here with a stuck engine this summer” so that means you do not really know the engine condition previously, is that correct? I think I remember you posting pictures of a pair of them you drug in or something like that. My answer would be the lack of compression is from a pre-existing condition. The pick-up and jerk rope was maybe a bit of an exaggeration, got to keep a little Tractor Vet blood circulating here in his absence. I still seriously doubt you can pull the wrist pin out of the bottom of a piston just jerking a tire around by hand. If that was the case this would be the cure for all stuck clutches!

Pistons can sometimes break at the oil ring groove and leave the top part at TDC while the skirt/pin area still reciprocates. Neighbors Cockshutt gas 273 Buda id that one fall picking corn. It still ran but would vibrate a LOT. Could be why the tractor was parked in the first place.