Measurements for ordering rebuild kit Ford 9N

[shameister]

My tractor restoration class is looking to get an engine rebuild kit for a Ford 9N and were told we need to make some measurements of a few things before ordering the kit. Can anyone tell us what and where to measure to make sure we get the right numbers?

 

[TheOldHokie]

(quoted from post at 10:32:49 08/24/23) My tractor restoration class is looking to get an engine rebuild kit for a Ford 9N and were told we need to make some measurements of a few things before ordering the kit. Can anyone tell us what and where to measure to make sure we get the right numbers?

Main and rod journsls. You need to know what undersize (.010, .020, .030. etc) you need. Who is yeaching this class?

TOH

 

[tractorguy2]

I wouldn't order anything without first tearing the engine. Lots of parts get swapped out over the years.

9n had thin wall sleeves but the block could be bored for heavy wall

Two different size oil pump gears.

Rod and main bearings need checked for size. Crank needs ground first to check size.

Does it still have mushroom valves or been converted to adjustable valves?

 

[Leroy]

Check crank for size before grinding. May not need grinding and a regrind is never as good as one not ground.

 

[Leroy]

Sounds like teacher does not know what he is doing. Piston and sleeve only
question is thin wall or thick wall. Or if no sleeve it is realy messed up
with automobile pistons for larger bore and then only hope for block is it
is not wore too much to be ground for thick wall sleves. Mercury automobile
pistons were used for that but not advisable

 

[Jim L WA]

(quoted from post at 10:08:11 08/24/23)

(quoted from post at 10:32:49 08/24/23)

Main and rod journsls. You need to know what undersize (.010, .020, .030. etc) you need. Who is yeaching this class?

TOH

That's what I was wondering. Is this a class or a club?

 

[shameister]

(quoted from post at 13:49:30 08/24/23)

(quoted from post at 10:08:11 08/24/23)

(quoted from post at 10:32:49 08/24/23)

Main and rod journsls. You need to know what undersize (.010, .020, .030. etc) you need. Who is yeaching this class?

TOH

That's what I was wondering. Is this a class or a club?

I am the ag yeacher and I am yeaching the class. First time rebuilding an engine as my students usually have them running before they are brought in as we have limited time for the class. We generally fix minor problems, blast, paint, and get them put back together. Just trying to learn myself as we go.

 

[shameister]

(quoted from post at 12:34:16 08/24/23) Sounds like teacher does not know what he is doing. Piston and sleeve only
question is thin wall or thick wall. Or if no sleeve it is realy messed up
with automobile pistons for larger bore and then only hope for block is it
is not wore too much to be ground for thick wall sleves. Mercury automobile
pistons were used for that but not advisable

If I knew the answer, why would I ask? That's why I'm coming here for help. This is my first engine rebuild and when I went to order a kit I was told to make sure I got all measurements but wasn't told what.

 

[shameister]

We've got it tore apart and we think it was all original. I'll have to do some checking on some of what you mentioned. This is my first engine rebuild. We got it running but it smoked something fierce so we opened it up and the sleeves were scored. We know we need new sleeves, piston heads and rings. We went to order a full kit so we could get everything we needed and they needed measurements of the sleeves and a few other things but couldn't tell me where to measure them at.

What do you mean by grinding the crank?

 

[HFJ]

the thickness of the sleeves will be either .040 or .090 inches. don't measure them at the lip.

 

[TheOldHokie]

(quoted from post at 20:14:53 08/24/23)
We've got it tore apart and we think it was all original. I'll have to do some checking on some of what you mentioned. This is my first engine rebuild. We got it running but it smoked something fierce so we opened it up and the sleeves were scored. We know we need new sleeves, piston heads and rings. We went to order a full kit so we could get everything we needed and they needed measurements of the sleeves and a few other things but couldn't tell me where to measure them at.

What do you mean by grinding the crank?

The journals on the crank are typically worn. You take the crank to a macine shop and they resurface (grind them). The result is a smaller diameter and you need to know how much smaller to order matching bearings. The machine shop will tell you what size mains and rods to order. They mains may be a different under size than rods.

Sleeves are .040 wall and removal/ installation is not strsightforward

Oil pump is 9/16 gears.

I suggest you get the Ford 8N service manual and study the section on engine overhaul. Right now you are over your head.and need more basic info than you can get here.

Manuals Are Your Friend

TOH

This post was edited by TheOldHokie on 08/25/2023 at 04:23 am.

 

[Tim PloughNman Daley RIP]

FORD originally used steel cylinder sleeves in their engines- that is why they stamped serial numbers with a star * symbol in prefix and suffix starting in 1931. After
1950 switched to cast iron sleeves, marked s/n with a <> diamond, and never looked back. Steel was a poor choice but cast iron liners couldn't be made yet. It's a moot
point nowadays because they no longer make steel liners. Did you guys take the block and head to a qualified machine shop and have them boiled? They will Magna-Flux
the cleaned parts to inspect for cracks and measure the cylinder bores. That way they know which kit to buy and can order the right one for you so cylinders and
pistons match. Many will also grind the crank too and get correct bearings too. Should be working with the I&T F0-4 Service Manual and the 39-53 MPC. Could also use
the 8N Dealer Service manual as well.

USING A PRECISION TELESCOPNG MICROMETER ID GAGE:

*A PRECISION DIAL BORE GAGE IS BEST SO OUT-OF-ROUND AND TAPER CAN BE MEASURED BETTER.

Tim Daley (MI)

 

[Eman85]

What do you have for measuring equipment? Do you have a local machinist that would come by and measure preferably in front of the students so they could see it done? do you have the manuals for this tractor?